Comments on: Did Lightning and Volcanoes Spark Life on Earth?

By: Peter

Peter — Wed, 22 Oct 2008 23:06:19 +0000

If life WAS formed by volcanism and associated lightning, wouldn't it still be forming? Are there more molecular sized life forms every year or so? Not necessarily all at once if multiple beginnings…one AFTER the other. And who is to say life was formed before surface water? Isn't the earliest earth life from well into the third billionth year? Stromatoliths formed on beaches didn't they?

By: Aodhhan

Aodhhan — Wed, 22 Oct 2008 11:18:30 +0000

FishFrog…

The idea water came from comets never really caught on with most of the scientific community… its just an ignorant way of saying we really don't know. Think about how many comets and or iced rocks it would have taken.. most of which would have vaporized on impact.

More than likely, it came from gasseous product from the forming of the early solar system… ie as in most planets were 'gas' planets when the sun began to clear out the solar system.

By: Trippy

Trippy — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 23:49:28 +0000

If Ethane in Titans atmosphere is formed primarily through photolysis of Methane, What do you think the other product's going to be.

It takes 2 methanes to make an ethane by photolysis, but two methanes have 8 hydrogens and two carbons, but Ethane only has 6 hydrogens.

Titan, however, does not have the gravity to hold onto substantial amounts of Hydrogen, and Earth recieves several times more UV radiation then Titan does.

Where you have Methane, and UV light, you have Hydrogen.

Where you have water in a strongly reducing environment, you also have hydrogen, and don't forget that most minerals have a water of crystalization.

The Earth has always had some water associated with it, it just hasn't neccessarily been free and available to form Oceans.

By: RetardedFishFrog

RetardedFishFrog — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 21:34:49 +0000

They keep saying Titan is an analog for the early Earth, and it has loads of methane and ethane. So what is it? No hydrogen or boatloads of hydrogen? I guess we'll need a time machine to know for sure.

Aodhhan – They say the water on Earth probably came from comets so there should have been plenty of it at the time.

By: watchful stone guardian

watchful stone guardian — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 18:51:55 +0000

Recently Scientific American had an article describing that various groups around the world are actually looking for evidence of multiple origins of life. If they could find some microscopic organism (bacteria or virus) that had a different chemistry such as amino acids or even genetic code then they'll have evidence that life started multiple times on Earth rather than just once. If life truly came into existence around volcanoes then the multiple origin hypothesis is more probable.

By: mike

mike — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 17:56:54 +0000

I remember the article in the Scientific American, as I recall about 1958; it was assumed that the early earth had a methane atmosphere. Glad to read the updates in this fine piece. Thanks MOK

By: Fritz Stumpges

Fritz Stumpges — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 14:48:20 +0000

Finding these building blocks is exciting, but still the real problem and requirement is for them to become 'alive'. What processes are required to meet the minimum requirements for life? What are the chances of creating a naturally occurring condition to form DNA and whatever else is needed?

By: john

john — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 11:26:12 +0000

It is possible that the lightning can also be found in gas and dust clouds in interstellar space. The lightning being provided by ultraviolet radiation from stars forming in the gas clouds which makes the Urey- Miller model even more practical for planetside and in space. More power to Jim Cleaves and Jeffrey Bada for reexamining the old test results. I look forward to more exciting news on this subject in due course.

By: Aodhhan

Aodhhan — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 11:02:58 +0000

If there are any geo-chemists out there…

I'm having problems believing there was any great amount of water in either scenarios. With the lack of hydrogen, and the way carbon binds to oxygen, I'm a bit baffled. Where did the water come from?
If hydrogen was present in the early "upper" atmosphere I could see it. Obviously, with the mix coming from volcanos it isn't going to be settling near the surface of the earth.

…and I'm still looking for anyone who has a good theory on where the nitrogen in early earth came from.
I'm open to any theories.

By: AndJamesMother

AndJamesMother — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 10:49:36 +0000

See what happens when you drop your child on his head?

Cardio would assume there is a heart created in the process. Defibrilliation would assume there is some sort of fibrillation, or in other words a mass quantity of nothing working together. In this case, it is obvious things ARE WORKING TOGETHER… The prefix adding you were some how stopping the lack of work…again which is wrong since things are already working together.

…i think your patent is safe, since it wouldn't get past the high school educated clerk.

By: Dave M

Dave M — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 10:12:23 +0000

I wonder if Miller and Urey were correct when they reported the 12 amino acids back in the fifties? Maybe the others have just slowly formed over the intervening years. I don't know, it's just a thought.

By: Mike

Mike — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 01:43:47 +0000

Was Miller's experiment reran using our current understanding of the atmospheric gases at the time life arose? If so what were the results?

By: Trippy

Trippy — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 23:24:52 +0000

Astrofiend:

Both the UCSD release I linked to earlier, and the Universe Today article say that Miller performed several experiments, and that these results were obtained from one of Millers original experiments.

Two of his students found the vials with the products from the original experiments, and re-did the analysis with modern equipment.

By: Astrofiend

Astrofiend — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 22:59:36 +0000

It's a shame Miller himself didn't think to do it before his death. It would have delighted him, I'm sure…

By: Astrofiend

Astrofiend — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 22:54:19 +0000

Such a beautiful experiment. As mentioned, so simple and yet so profound… And the fact that they discovered every single amino acid present in life from such basic initial conditions? It just speaks, nay – shouts for itself…

I might set one up myself just because it's awesome.

By: Jorge

Jorge — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 21:33:55 +0000

I most surely don't. I much prefer a local origin for life (implying that it can originate anywhere with the same set of conditions) to an extraterrestrial one, which simply transfers elsehwere the how and when of the origin of life and implies that the beginnings are much harder. Theories of a local origin provide more complete explanations of the whole process. Not that panspermia is impossible, but it's much less likely than the local origin.

By: LLDIAZ

LLDIAZ — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 19:15:07 +0000

I still feel a bacteria laced asteroid sounds better…

By: Sofia

Sofia — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 17:42:44 +0000

Brrr…
But it' s a good discovery after all.

By: Trippy

Trippy — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 17:38:52 +0000

Originally available from Scripps UCSD.

Heh, maybe next time I'll just e-mail Nancy directly.

http://scrippsnews.ucsd.edu/Releases/?releaseID=930

By: watchful stone guardian

watchful stone guardian — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 16:59:37 +0000

Good old Occam and his razor. The simple ideas are the most elegant. Who needs supernatural beings, aliens, or bits of interstellar bacteria? Broth, brimstone, and a bolt of lightning works just fine!

By: AndJames

AndJames — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 16:27:50 +0000

I like it. Simply, the technical term should be……

Gaea cardio defibrillation