Comments on: Searching for Water and Minerals on Mars – Implications for Colonization http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/ Space and astronomy news Sun, 22 Nov 2009 00:56:59 -0600 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: M-A MAN http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-2/#comment-22511 M-A MAN Mon, 02 Jun 2008 02:54:57 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-22511 The idea of MARTIANAMERICANS.COM came to me on last December of 07 during a walk to starbucks coffee. The look of the main website was going to be different than what it is now. I was forced to build the website in two days before the launch date (Feb 1st 08) after a company in LA failed to deliver on time. The intention behind the idea is to cover planet earth and help the sick kids with leukemia. I hope you enjoy all the talent and the music of our friends. Yes, we will have many good days to come. M-A MAN (SPACE & MUSIC FOREVER) The idea of MARTIANAMERICANS.COM came to me on last December of 07 during a walk to starbucks coffee. The look of the main website was going to be different than what it is now. I was forced to build the website in two days before the launch date (Feb 1st 08) after a company in LA failed to deliver on time. The intention behind the idea is to cover planet earth and help the sick kids with leukemia. I hope you enjoy all the talent and the music of our friends. Yes, we will have many good days to come.

M-A MAN (SPACE & MUSIC FOREVER)

]]> By: Christian http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-2/#comment-21498 Christian Fri, 23 May 2008 17:45:51 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-21498 such amazing discoveries they have made such amazing discoveries they have made

]]> By: John Wilkinson http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-20744 John Wilkinson Sun, 18 May 2008 08:11:00 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-20744 The one thing that might be brought back to earth is Helium3 from the moon The one thing that might be brought back to earth is Helium3 from the moon

]]> By: Va. Gent http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-20038 Va. Gent Fri, 09 May 2008 16:01:25 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-20038 A question was once asked " Of what value is a new born baby?". Learning/discovery is just like the new born. We will never know its value until done. I am old enough to have experienced seeing the advances we as a people received from the offshoots of the space program from the 1950's forward. All this time people kept saying "No value, no return on our tax dollars." and when the many lifesaving and modern conveniences are produced for us from "these useless programs" nary a word of "I/we were wrong" was ever heard.". So what value is there of a new born baby? A question was once asked " Of what value is a new born baby?". Learning/discovery is just like the new born. We will never know its value until done.
I am old enough to have experienced seeing the advances we as a people received from the offshoots of the space program from the 1950's forward. All this time people kept saying "No value, no return on our tax dollars." and when the many lifesaving and modern conveniences are produced for us from "these useless programs" nary a word of "I/we were wrong" was ever heard.". So what value is there of a new born baby?

]]> By: Jorge http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19689 Jorge Tue, 06 May 2008 13:56:58 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19689 Wha?! :o Why on Earth (or on the Moon) would anyone want to spend gazillions of your favorite currency (seems to be the Euro these days) to bring down from the Moon something we have in huge quantities on Earth?! Something we'd probably end up needing to export to the Moon if ever a colony is established up there?! Trust me: nobody is that crazy. I'm actually rather sceptical about space mining industries, unless they are meant to provide raw materials for *space* endeavours. I could imagine that mining asteroids to send raw materials to orbital factories producing stuff that requires microgravity would be more cost-effective than sending those materials up from Earth, but I'm pretty much convinced that only in very peculiar situations would it pay to mine asteroids to send stuff down to Earth. We still have a long way to go in recycling before we even begin to exhaust most of our non-energetic resources. Because our main problem is, and allways will be, energy. That's the one thing we can't recycle. Once spent, it stays spent. There's no way around entropy. Wha?! :o

Why on Earth (or on the Moon) would anyone want to spend gazillions of your favorite currency (seems to be the Euro these days) to bring down from the Moon something we have in huge quantities on Earth?! Something we'd probably end up needing to export to the Moon if ever a colony is established up there?!

Trust me: nobody is that crazy.

I'm actually rather sceptical about space mining industries, unless they are meant to provide raw materials for *space* endeavours. I could imagine that mining asteroids to send raw materials to orbital factories producing stuff that requires microgravity would be more cost-effective than sending those materials up from Earth, but I'm pretty much convinced that only in very peculiar situations would it pay to mine asteroids to send stuff down to Earth. We still have a long way to go in recycling before we even begin to exhaust most of our non-energetic resources.

Because our main problem is, and allways will be, energy. That's the one thing we can't recycle. Once spent, it stays spent. There's no way around entropy.

]]> By: Gudenboink http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19652 Gudenboink Mon, 05 May 2008 23:44:04 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19652 No money to be made in Space?? Potential is everywhere!! Mining will be the start. It would be a sure bet that once Titanium - Magnesium - water ect. and other minerals are confirmed on the Moon and Mars that SOMEONE in the corporate world will be quick to finance a mining operation as soon as possible. It may take a few years to develope, but the only thing that is missing is the confirmation, and the process will begin before the ink dries on the article. When water is found on the Moon, it won't surprise me if someone wants to bring it back, even as costly and self defeating as that sounds. Theres a Planet-full of greedy people down here. We should use the minerals found to further our Space exploration though, and only for Space. No money to be made in Space?? Potential is everywhere!! Mining will be the start.
It would be a sure bet that once Titanium – Magnesium – water ect. and other minerals are confirmed on the Moon and Mars that SOMEONE in the corporate world will be quick to finance a mining operation as soon as possible. It may take a few years to develope, but the only thing that is missing is the confirmation, and the process will begin before the ink dries on the article.

When water is found on the Moon, it won't surprise me if someone wants to bring it back, even as costly and self defeating as that sounds.
Theres a Planet-full of greedy people down here.

We should use the minerals found to further our Space exploration though, and only for Space.

]]> By: astrofarmerdude http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19648 astrofarmerdude Mon, 05 May 2008 23:20:51 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19648 Lets look at what has been accomplished in the last 100 years in science and engineering and then look at what many famous scientists and science advocates of the past have speculated would happen in the next 100 years. Negative comments like "Humans will never fly in a aircraft" , "Rockets wont fly in the vacuum of space because there is nothing to push against in space " and Paul Goddard is living a fantasy" and "there will only be maybe a thousand home computers ever in the world".. sound familiar ? It will only take a few major break throughs and pioneerin spirit to jump start the new systems needed to colonize space . Nuclear or Lasar or some other new idea of propulsion are some and I can't imagine the unknown others which may occur in the next 25 years even. So I am only a gnostic/agnostic and will not stick my neck out and say anything is too difficult to implement in the near future... except maybe space elevators , but there I go again creeping towards being a "Nay Sayer" myself. Lets look at what has been accomplished in the last 100 years in science and engineering and then look at what many famous scientists and science advocates of the past have speculated would happen in the next 100 years.
Negative comments like "Humans will never fly in a aircraft" , "Rockets wont fly in the vacuum of space because there is nothing to push against in space " and Paul Goddard is living a fantasy" and "there will only be maybe a thousand home computers ever in the world".. sound familiar ?
It will only take a few major break throughs and pioneerin spirit to jump start the new systems needed to colonize space .
Nuclear or Lasar or some other new idea of propulsion are some and I can't imagine the unknown others which may occur in the next 25 years even.
So I am only a gnostic/agnostic and will not stick my neck out and say anything is too difficult to implement in the near future… except maybe space elevators , but there I go again creeping towards being a "Nay Sayer" myself.

]]> By: nero http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19643 nero Mon, 05 May 2008 20:16:49 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19643 Ray Bradbury would be proud. Ray Bradbury would be proud.

]]> By: Ross http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19639 Ross Mon, 05 May 2008 20:01:27 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19639 Going to mars? himm, not at $200,000.00 dollars per seat. Lets face it, in 39 years the best mankind can do is to put up a few cans tied together into orbit for about 10 years. The shuttle fleet is set to be decommissioned in 2010, the I.S.S. is set to be decommissioned in 2015, and N.A.S.A. is not going to try landing man on the moon again untill 2020-2025. He might put a can on the moon by 2050, maybe put a can in orbit around the moon and call it a lunar station by 2075, and then maybe try to shoot for the Martian moons by 2100, then maybe,,,maybe try landing on Mars, IF, he can lift off and reach Mars orbit again. Oh! wait! this will cost trillions of dollars to do!! Some how with all the major budget cuts Congress has dished out to N.A.S.A already, I just don't see this happening with in the next 100 years. I just can't see the craft, houseing, supplies, waste disposel, safety suits, etc, etc, being paid for buy Congress or the Corporate world. Why you may ask? Because theres something missing in space.....MONEY TO BE MADE. Now, if you could build something out there to sell, like rental units for labs, at about 125-250,000.00 per month, and an affordable means of transportation for people and cargo after 2010, plus a resource of inexpensive supplies to ferry up from time to time, and return waste products, and cheap fuel costs, for about a fraction of that cost, then you might have something for hope. Untill there is a population out there, Corporations like Burger King, Hilton hotels, and K-marts stores are just not going to be intrested in being there. There in is where our problem lays. There is no one to do buisness with out there. There is no known resource to be mined that would offer a reasonable profit yeild, so Exxon isn't intrested eather. Though Christopher Columbus wondered over here to find the New World, and Americans pioneered the great west, I don't think there will be a pioneer to set sail to the Moon or Mars any time soon. Those sail boats cost to much to build by one country or person alone. Heck, Burt Rutan and Richard Branson together barely can make a craft to reach standard orbit with all their billions of dollers and pounds. Burt Rutans' been working on this for the past 20 years too. Maybe in another 100 years.........Maybe. Going to mars? himm, not at $200,000.00 dollars per seat.

Lets face it, in 39 years the best mankind can do is to put up a few cans tied together into orbit for about 10 years. The shuttle fleet is set to be decommissioned in 2010, the I.S.S. is set to be decommissioned in 2015, and N.A.S.A. is not going to try landing man on the moon again untill 2020-2025. He might put a can on the moon by 2050, maybe put a can in orbit around the moon and call it a lunar station by 2075, and then maybe try to shoot for the Martian moons by 2100, then maybe,,,maybe try landing on Mars, IF, he can lift off and reach Mars orbit again. Oh! wait! this will cost trillions of dollars to do!! Some how with all the major budget cuts Congress has dished out to N.A.S.A already, I just don't see this happening with in the next 100 years.

I just can't see the craft, houseing, supplies, waste disposel, safety suits, etc, etc, being paid for buy Congress or the Corporate world. Why you may ask? Because theres something missing in space…..MONEY TO BE MADE.

Now, if you could build something out there to sell, like rental units for labs, at about 125-250,000.00 per month, and an affordable means of transportation for people and cargo after 2010, plus a resource of inexpensive supplies to ferry up from time to time, and return waste products, and cheap fuel costs, for about a fraction of that cost, then you might have something for hope.

Untill there is a population out there, Corporations like Burger King, Hilton hotels, and K-marts stores are just not going to be intrested in being there. There in is where our problem lays. There is no one to do buisness with out there. There is no known resource to be mined that would offer a reasonable profit yeild, so Exxon isn't intrested eather.

Though Christopher Columbus wondered over here to find the New World, and Americans pioneered the great west, I don't think there will be a pioneer to set sail to the Moon or Mars any time soon. Those sail boats cost to much to build by one country or person alone. Heck, Burt Rutan and Richard Branson together barely can make a craft to reach standard orbit with all their billions of dollers and pounds. Burt Rutans' been working on this for the past 20 years too.

Maybe in another 100 years………Maybe.

]]> By: Dave http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19633 Dave Mon, 05 May 2008 18:32:09 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19633 Unless Mars could be terra-formed into having an atmosphere compatible with human life what is the point? If we wanted to live in a place where we had to stay inside to survive we could either live in many of the major cities around the world, under the ocean or the poles. Unless Mars could be terra-formed into having an atmosphere compatible with human life what is the point? If we wanted to live in a place where we had to stay inside to survive we could either live in many of the major cities around the world, under the ocean or the poles.

]]> By: Tony Trenton http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19629 Tony Trenton Mon, 05 May 2008 18:10:57 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19629 Has everybody forgotten about the lack of a magnetic field to protect the lives of the humans who go there from the cosmic radiation? Has everybody forgotten about the lack of a magnetic field to protect the lives of the humans who go there from the cosmic radiation?

]]> By: Ian O'Neill http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19625 Ian O'Neill Mon, 05 May 2008 17:33:24 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19625 According to NASA (if I recall correctly), if all the ice on Mars were to be melted, the planet would be covered - on average - in water to an 11 meter depth. So I'd imagine it will fill the canyons of Valles Marineris for example, but leave much of the Tharsis Bulge dry... I'll need to get all the figures on this though and need to check my references.... According to NASA (if I recall correctly), if all the ice on Mars were to be melted, the planet would be covered – on average – in water to an 11 meter depth. So I'd imagine it will fill the canyons of Valles Marineris for example, but leave much of the Tharsis Bulge dry… I'll need to get all the figures on this though and need to check my references….

]]> By: Jorge http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19615 Jorge Mon, 05 May 2008 16:02:02 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19615 Well, I got too curious, so I tried to come up with an approximation by myself. Lacking a proper altitude profile for Mars, though, I had to use a bump map and its colour histogram, which can only provide a very crude approximation, because it uses an equirectangular projection, which generates heavy distortions: pixels correspond to widely different areas around the planet. But still... The numbers I got would mean that all the polar water would only fill most of Hellas Planitia and a few deeper craters up north. I'm pretty sure that the error is large, though, so if there is anyone out there with better numbers, shoot. Well, I got too curious, so I tried to come up with an approximation by myself. Lacking a proper altitude profile for Mars, though, I had to use a bump map and its colour histogram, which can only provide a very crude approximation, because it uses an equirectangular projection, which generates heavy distortions: pixels correspond to widely different areas around the planet. But still…

The numbers I got would mean that all the polar water would only fill most of Hellas Planitia and a few deeper craters up north. I'm pretty sure that the error is large, though, so if there is anyone out there with better numbers, shoot.

]]> By: Jorge http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19604 Jorge Mon, 05 May 2008 13:42:29 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19604 Good one! I'm curious: did anyone mathed it out to figure how much of Mars (and which parts) would be flooded in case all that water liquified? (And yes, I know that we'd need a thick and warm atmosphere first. But I'm still curious) Good one!

I'm curious: did anyone mathed it out to figure how much of Mars (and which parts) would be flooded in case all that water liquified?

(And yes, I know that we'd need a thick and warm atmosphere first. But I'm still curious)

]]> By: Chuck Lam http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19602 Chuck Lam Mon, 05 May 2008 13:38:52 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19602 Peter Brouwer is correct. However, he missed a major factor. The return on billions of dollars of investment. Mankind will eventually get a research team on the surface of Mars. Colonization? I doubt that will happen in this century. Peter Brouwer is correct. However, he missed a major factor. The return on billions of dollars of investment. Mankind will eventually get a research team on the surface of Mars. Colonization? I doubt that will happen in this century.

]]> By: Peter Brouwer http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19596 Peter Brouwer Mon, 05 May 2008 12:58:38 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19596 The Dream is good but the money and will are lacking ! The Dream is good but the money and will are lacking !

]]> By: marcellus http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19595 marcellus Mon, 05 May 2008 12:57:00 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19595 A very cool article. I watched Mars last night as it drew into a perfectly straight line with Pollux and Castor in Gemini. I hope we can land humans on Mars in my lifetime. A very cool article. I watched Mars last night as it drew into a perfectly straight line with Pollux and Castor in Gemini. I hope we can land humans on Mars in my lifetime.

]]> By: Steven Casey http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19589 Steven Casey Mon, 05 May 2008 07:59:25 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19589 Air, water, sunlight, put this on the Moon and we would be one step closer to getting to the stars. We have to do it eventually, we should start now. Air, water, sunlight, put this on the Moon and we would be one step closer to getting to the stars. We have to do it eventually, we should start now.

]]> By: Steve http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19583 Steve Mon, 05 May 2008 05:17:02 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19583 Is CRISM able to tell if the minerals were a direct result of an impact and deposited from the meteroite or actually formed in the martian interior? Is CRISM able to tell if the minerals were a direct result of an impact and deposited from the meteroite or actually formed in the martian interior?

]]> By: Vanamonde http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19582 Vanamonde Mon, 05 May 2008 05:13:42 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19582 I am sure that Kim Stanley Robinson also knew that "Underhill" was also a name that one Frodo Baggins of Bag End in the Shire of Middle Earth used in an earlier fictional epic. His home was in the side of a hill. But it is good news to hear about the water on Mars! It will help, with the thin air, high radiation and severe cold. "Mars ain't no place to raise a kid". I am sure that Kim Stanley Robinson also knew that "Underhill" was also a name that one Frodo Baggins of Bag End in the Shire of Middle Earth used in an earlier fictional epic. His home was in the side of a hill.

But it is good news to hear about the water on Mars! It will help, with the thin air, high radiation and severe cold. "Mars ain't no place to raise a kid".

]]> By: vag http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19581 vag Mon, 05 May 2008 04:36:35 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19581 What happened to the sagittarius nova? Or was it just a hoax/mistake? What happened to the sagittarius nova? Or was it just a hoax/mistake?

]]> By: aju http://www.universetoday.com/2008/05/04/searching-for-water-and-minerals-on-mars-implications-for-colonization/comment-page-1/#comment-19579 aju Mon, 05 May 2008 01:53:59 +0000 http://www.universetoday.com/?p=14037#comment-19579 Posted this link in www.surfurls.com Posted this link in http://www.surfurls.com

]]>